Violin Forum/Message Board

Becky · Senior Member Joined: 09 Apr 2007 Posts: 83

The violin I'm currently gaining repair experience with has open seams galore. The bottom plate is completely detached from the ribs on the entire treble side from the neck block down to the end block. The top plate is also detached from the ribs for all of this area too, except the C bout where the ribs are still firmly attached. The ribs are also detached from themself at both the corners on this side. There are no corner blocks. Despite all of this unattachedness everything easily pops into place and stays relatively well. Normally I would just glue the ribs back to the plates, but the fact that the ribs are not joined at the corners has thrown me for a loop. What should I do?

Also, I have spool clamps for fixing open seams but have nothing special for the rib corners. International Violin has a special clamp for this, but it's more than I can spend on a single clamp at this time--especially when I don't even know if this violin is worth it. Is there a way to repair this without buying this clamp or should I start saving my pennies?

Mark Sullivan · Posted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:53 pm Post subject:

To rejoin the ribs, maybe a spring type clothes pin or two lined with something that stop them from sliding off the corner without doing damage to the varnish or distorting the joint. Maybe thin strips cut from rubber can opening aid.

DonLeister · Posted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 11:46 pm Post subject:

Becky,
Maybe cut a block of wood with a 'v' shape cut into it , that fits the rib miter, 28mm or so high (shorter than the rib ht. at the corner) and wedge the rib miter into it ( >>) and clamp the block across the body.
I tried the $ corner clamp one time, I worked in a shop that had one, and found it awkward and not very effective.
On second thought, if the corner is loose from the top and back plates then that may not work.
Maybe some miniature 'quick clamps' with the rubber pads on the jaws with some chalk or rosin on the pads will grab well enough to do the job.

Becky · Senior Member Joined: 09 Apr 2007 Posts: 83

Thanks for the clamping ideas. Don, I was happy to hear the $$ clamp is not worth it.

Should I fix the rib corners first? or reglue the plates to the ribs first? or do it all at the same time?

L P Reedy · Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 6:35 pm Post subject:

I'm new here, so don't pay too much attention to what I say. I would probably glue one rib to the back first, leaving the other rib loose. Then glue the other rib and the corner joint at the same time. If you try to do it all at once you probably won't have enough hands. I THINK that my way would help with alignment.

But, like Manfio always says, I may be wrong.

Lyle

DonLeister · Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2009 11:54 pm Post subject:

Glue the rib miter first is what I would do, clean up any glue that squeezes out so when you glue the plates on it's a good fit. If you're in a hurry it might glue up all at once ok, that would be what I call meatball surgery.

I'm curious about the corner miter clamp, is there anyone here that uses it?

FiddleDoug · Member Joined: 08 Sep 2007 Posts: 227 Location: Hilton, NY

You might consider removing the top, so that you can get to the inside of the corners. When I'm working on blockless instruments, I often reinforce the corners with a little piece of linen and some glue. After that, get the back glued on and clean up any excess glue on the inside. After the back has dried, dry fit the front, and check the neck angle. When gluing the front on, pay attention to the neck angle, and make any needed adjustments before final tightening of the upper bout spool clamps.
_________________
Doug Wall

www.wallindependent.com

Jack H. · Posted: Tue Apr 28, 2009 7:56 am Post subject:

To glue the ribs back together you can make a jig from wood in the shape of a rounded m with a deep adn narrowing grove inbetween the hums. make 4 and fit them to apply the pressure right at the tips where the wood of the ribs meets to be glued.

When a seam is opened, it generally means that the area just after the area that is open is also suspect.
use an opening knife and very light pressure to see how much farther it will open and were exactly it is glued well.
Then glue the back, using care to maintain proper position of the back in reference to the ribs.
Remember, it might fit well with finger pressure and no glue, but the minute you add glue, it initially acts like a lubricant and the wood will want to move. Be careful to keep the ribs lined up while gluing!

Let us know how it came out!

Geemac · Posted: Sun May 03, 2009 11:25 am Post subject:

Becky, make your own clamps. It's easy. Buy a 1.25 inch by 6 feet dowel, the right sized screw and wing nuts to fit the screws. Cut the dowel into 1 inch lengths. Drill a centered hole in each. Insert the screw into two dowel pieces and add the wing nut. If you wish, glue a thin layer of cork to the inside of each dowel piece. And you're ready to clamp. This style of clamp has very precise pressure control and are well worth the effort.
_________________
GeeMac

Becky · Senior Member Joined: 09 Apr 2007 Posts: 83

This project took the back burner in favor of some other instruments, but I've been back to work on it this week. I glued the open seams on the upper bout, a little on the upper half of the middle, and the rib corner all at the same time and the gluing part went well. I didn't tackle the bottom half yet, but had it clamped (especially the open corner at the ribs) to keep everything in place. I rigged up my own clamping arrangement and will post pictures providing it all turned out. The dry run went well and I'm eager to take the clamps off and see how it turned out.

Geemac · Posted: Sun Sep 06, 2009 9:57 pm Post subject:

I once repaired a cracked top on a German violin. When I removed the top, I found that there where no blocks in the waist area. There were gluing blocks only at the Neck join and the tail.
_________________
GeeMac

Becky · Senior Member Joined: 09 Apr 2007 Posts: 83

The violin turned out great! I was going to post pictures of my clamping arrangement (involving spool clamps for the open seams, clothespins, and a c clamp) as well as the end result, but can't get my pictures to post...[/img]

John Cadd · Posted: Mon Oct 19, 2009 1:41 pm Post subject: gluing

Here`s an improvised clamp idea for you. When you have the top off and you want to hold the corners in place you can make a three way clamp.This is not for pressing onto the back but for holding the sides to each other.
Get some round wooden blocks with central holes .Smooth them off to look slightly barrel shaped.Fit long screws through them and tie the"pointy " ends together.The last ingredient is an elastic band.
With this arrangement you can put one block inside and one block on each corner face.The elastic gives the initial position more easily.Once in place you bind around the screws to tighten everything up.No slipping involved.