Violin Forum/Message Board

[jethro]

I am ready to graduate violin #2 (lots of stress !)
Has anyone tried (or have an opinion on) keith hill's area tuneing scheme?
I just ned to decide if I should risk trying it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have only used relatively symmetrical (conventional) patterns .
Tim

[MANFIO]

If you have built less than 15 instruments, I think there are still more important issues to deal with, such as the archings, model, f hole placement, set up, varnish and ground, etc., I would focus in these things (that have a huge impact in the sound too) prior to try such things.

Archings have have huge effect on sound, perhaps more than graduations. If graduations alone were all that important, 90% of Del Gesù violins would worth nothing, since they were regraduated, with few exceptions.

Just my two cents. But I'm too conservative...
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[KenN]

I saw that online too. I think his varnish idea would be a better bet to try. I've tapped all the plates I've made, just to hear what they are, not doing anything with them, and they have sounds all over the place! Just trying to figure out what tones in the series you're supposed to be listening for and then changing it would be a lot of trouble. I've tried the modal tuning, thinning areas to bring modes to certain pitches or relationships, and I'm not sure that does anything at all. I saw one site on guitars where the guy says he just tries to get as many different pitches as possible when he thins his plates. I know they are different animals from violins, but that approach seems better than making a plate that is very uniform. Maybe (maybe?) I'm nuts but plate tuning seems like is a waste of time.

[jethro]

Thanks Manfeo:
I too --- am conservative-- because I don't want to ruin a plate with so many man
hours in it ! Number one had a little higher than normal arching on both plates, both plates a little thin (.200 inches) , and very little channel depth.
I spent a couple of weeks getting the graduation VERY uniform on both plates , probably +/- .002 inches. Seems like to me most of the graduation maps aren't that accurate. Anyway violin #1 has LOADS
of vollume and good sound quality. Only area it lacks is as you go up
the E string the last third at the top the vollume drops a little --- goes to
a whisper from a hearty powerfull sound.
Do you think it would be conservative to split the difference between
this arching /thickness and the standard (ie Strobel) ??????
Or would you say go strictly conventional 100% ???????????
I don't know how adventureious to be !
Perhaps I should go into Violin therapy in Vienna at a sanatarium for
Luthiers !!!!!

[MANFIO]

Thicknesses may relate to the archings, and archings are more important than thicknesses, I think. The more sophisticated is your archings, the better will be the sound of your instruments.

What I do for the back is leaving the thicker region on the "reversed stop", a bit above the geometric center of the back. If I make this point 5 milimeters thick, I will make the thinnest point half of it, that is, 2.5 milimeters. I start leaving the thickest point untouched and thinning from the lower and upper bouts towards the center. For the top I prefer an uniform thickness.
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[jethro]

Sorry Manfeo, I mis-stated my thickness of my top -- it wasn't .200
inches it was about .110 inches for the top plate thickness. About .095
near the channel and maybe about .140 -.150 near the wings. I remember shooting for .130 and overshot to about .110.
I built a thickness "caliper" from a plunger type dial indicator mounted
like a C clamp. When I'm carving I let it "pinch" the plate and then
slowly draw the plate across the caliper watching the dial. I can easily
see bulges or depressions if the needle rises or falls. I do this in a
X and Y grid all over the plate as I am thinning. Slow but works well.
I took appart a commercial violin a while back (not a really cheap one
either) and you could see they graduated the plated with a small air
powered sander with a 2 inch disk. Not a bad idea if you are steady
enough. I ran the plates through my caliper and they were pretty
lumpy compared to mine ! You could clearly still see rough swirls
from probably a 60 or 80 grit sanding disk. No scraper here!

When you refer to a more complecated arching being better......
what do you mean by complecated ????? Do you mean how much
care is taken while cutting and adjusting or do you mean the
geometric shape of the mathmatical curve used to define the main
arch shape. I would love to know what "complicated" means if it
produces a better instrument !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(who's not for that !!!!!!!)
Looking foreword to finnishing violin 2 to find out if #1 was a fortunate
fluke or if I can improve some every time .

tim.