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Most prestigious wood for violin parts?

 
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Stratovarious
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Joined: 08 Jul 2014
Posts: 4
Location: Bristol, UK

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 7:54 am    Post subject: Most prestigious wood for violin parts? Reply with quote

Before I ask my question I had better introduce myself as this is only about my second or third post here.

I live in Bristol which is in the southwest of the UK. I'm a guitar and bass player from way back, but have always dabbled with other instruments. I've now decided to start learning the violin and am quite serious about it, to the extent that I'm actually going to take lessons. (I never had lessons on any of my other instruments, as anyone who has heard me play will testify.)

My problem is that due to continuing poverty, I am unable to afford a decent instrument, so have started buying violins in need of refurbishment and working on them myself. This holds no terrors for me as I have always done my own guitar maintenance such as rewiring, replacing pickups, setups etc. Indeed this year I even taught myself how to level and reprofile frets - a bit ironic really for the violin, as someone seems to have forgotten to add frets! (I do draw the line at carpentry however - wood just doesn't seem to like me.)

So I've bought a few violins, the idea being that after refurbishment, I will keep the best one to use myself, and the others I will sell on to offset some of my costs.

So to my question (at last, you must be thinking.) I would like 'my' violin to be a bit nicer than the others, and it seems one of the ways it can look 'classier' is to fit better parts - given that the pegs, tailpiece, chinrest and endpin will probably need replacing anyway. Now I always thought ebony was the most 'prestigious' wood, given that many top of the range guitars have ebony fingerboards rather than rosewood. But researching this, I find many suppliers are offering parts sets in rosewood, boxwood, something called 'jujube' and even, in one or two cases, maple.

Is there any consensus of opinion as to which of these is the most desirable, or is it all down to just personal taste? Perhaps more importantly, do they have any bearing on the sound?
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Cliff Green
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Location: Amissville, Virginia

PostPosted: Wed Jul 09, 2014 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the choice of fittings is generally a choice in esthetics since you will see all types on fine instruments. That said, a lot of the so called boxwood fittings are too soft plus you have to stain them after being trimmed. Ebony has fine grain, takes a high polish, shaves well and is very stable which is a plus. Rosewood can look nice and works OK.
Personally I like the understatement of nice ebony but I also like mountain mahogany.
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kjb
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find the ebony easier to shave with the pegs than the mahogany, never used boxwood, although I do have a supply.
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Dave Chandler
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Location: Mt Mitchell in North Carolina

PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 7:53 pm    Post subject: Type of wood Reply with quote

I've recently replaced the fittings on my favorite violin, which was on the reddish side. I had boxwood fittings, but the yellow/orange color clashed so I changed everything to ebony. It really looks great now.

Boxwood is the easiest to work with, cutting pegs is like cutting butter. You can get some chatter with ebony, especially cheap ebony, so you need to go slowly and sometimes put a little beeswax on the peg to get smoother cutting.

I think its more a matter of taste, and what looks best for a given finish. Violinists are traditionalists, and tend to go for understated simplicity and elegance. Nice simple ebony fits most applications, but get the better (moderately priced - not cheapest) priced pieces and you won't go wrong.
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Last edited by Dave Chandler on Thu Jul 10, 2014 9:41 pm; edited 2 times in total
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DonLeister
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Joined: 29 Mar 2007
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Location: Richmond, VA

PostPosted: Thu Jul 10, 2014 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the consensus will depend on where you look. I like to look at lots of old fine violins for what is desirable.

I'm thinking you might like these; http://www.pegheds.com
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Stratovarious
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Joined: 08 Jul 2014
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Location: Bristol, UK

PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 2:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that info Don - these must be like the Wittner fine tuning pegs I've already come across, indeed I was discussing them with a local violin shop just yesterday. The downside though, is that they only come in black, which means I'd have to either stick with ebony for the other parts, or put up with a clash!

It's certainly miles better than my idea of fitting guitar tuners. Bit of a dead end, that one.
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wm_crash
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Camphorwood pegs . . . . release some scent every time they are turned Smile

cheers,
wm_crash, the friendly hooligan
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DonLeister
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Stratovarious, actually they can be had with different wood thumb pieces or you can send a set of your pegs and Mr. Herrin will attach them to the geared shafts, about $160 or so.

I have used Wittners too, which are a little heavier and geared 8:1 or so, but they only come in black plastic.
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FiddleDoug
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 9:33 am    Post subject: It's not about how it looks, Reply with quote

It's about how it plays and sounds. You apparently have some experience with guitars, but violins are totally different. Please research any repairs or restorations before trying them, to avoid irreversible mistakes. Learning proper set-up is a must! A good luthier can make huge improvement on many instruments, and a poor luthier can make a good instrument much worse.
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ctviolin
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 20, 2014 3:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Most prestigious wood for violin parts? Reply with quote

Stratovarious wrote:

Is there any consensus of opinion as to which of these is the most desirable, or is it all down to just personal taste? Perhaps more importantly, do they have any bearing on the sound?

Desirable... for what?
Personal taste?
Tone?
As far as fittings go, there isn't much difference, other than aesthetic considerations, - & to a lesser degree with the wood component of the accessories, perhaps a longevity decision.

The choice of spruce and maple for the body of the instrument are what determines the tone or the sound or the general 'color' of the fiddle, in orders of magnitude, more than the choice of 'fittings' wood will.

And yes, what everyone has said about set-up holds true also. Set up is the greatest thing you can learn when starting out in particular with second hand or used fiddles or violins. If you have no luthier near you, that you can bug in person, then the internet has much worth gleaning from.
But - you must be a persistent or a prolific gleaner, and have a voracious appetite in order to cut through much of the crap.

If you can muster the energy to post photos of your attempts or questions..., here there are many (I know that they are usually quiet, that's the way it is here) voices about everything.
You will get only first rate help here, but you must be explicit with your questions.
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Lemuel
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very interesting....I kind of feel out of place now.... :s

I've noticed some sound difference when changing fittings of different wood,
especially the chinrest.

I've noticed ebony tends to be brighter, boxwood more mellow and warmer,
and rosewood darker. A surprising number of people (advanced players)
have come to us about pernambucco fittings.
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kjb
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 23, 2014 6:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i Have seen a lot of discussion of the sound of the tailpiece , FB, and fittings and how they affect sound, but that is way beyond my skill level at this point. I might try some things out at some point. I do have some 30 or 40 year old boxwood to play with.
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Michael Darnton
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think there are all sorts of tonal differences with fittings, and sometimes it's hard to track down the source. Chinrests are particularly dicey, because they hold a very active part of the instrument and 1mm one way or another can make a huge difference, sometimes.

In the most general way, I feel like pernambuco thins the sound in a way I don't care for, though it does make things pop a bit. I'd generally agree with Lemuel's comments.
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kjb
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

does the shoulder rest , if used also have such and effect that you have noticed?
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Michael Darnton
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard dramatic differences between with and without the shoulder rest. It's part of the sound of the older generation of players to not have used one. I don't know if people are aware that Yehudi Menuhin started the use of shoulder rests to provide himself relief from a shoulder injury, not for technical playing reasons. When you watch people like Milstein play they aren't holding the violin in the death grip that modern players use, and they seemed to get along just fine. When I see someone using a shoulder rest, it appears to me like watching someone on the street with a crutch.
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