Violin Forum/Message Board

actonern · Super Member Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 444

Geary Baese has been referred to by Greg Alf, Joseph Curtin, for example, as someone who came up with a historically based varnish approach/recipie.

Does anyone know what it is? I've googled everywhere and can't find any reference to it.

Best regards...

JWH · Member Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 72

The one based upon a 16th century Venetian Marciana Manuscript most talked about here is a simple 2 parts linseed oil, 1 part Greek pitch (otherwise known as colophony), 1 part mastic all boiled together.

MANFIO · Posted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 7:25 pm Post subject:

Geary Baese wrote a book called CLASSIC ITALIAN VIOLIN VARNISH, there is one for sale at AMAZON for ... ... 649 bucks!!!! I've paid 100 bucks on mine a decade ago!!!

Well, from the small circle of top makers I know it seems that the oil/colophony/mastic - the Biblioteca Marciana recipe - is the most used.
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actonern · Super Member Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 444

I phoned Geary about 2 years ago wondering if he sold his varnish. He told me that his approach was to provide the information in the course of a 1 week program, and that every participant would have to sign a confidentiality agreement.

It kind of spooked me... perhaps I shouldn't be asking.

MANFIO · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 8:48 am Post subject:

Violin making is already complicated, just too many details. In my current system I make the ground with my own oil varnish and follow with Pading's (Magister Products) DORATURA ROSSA or VERNICE LIQUIDA varnishes that I modify to my necessities.

Pading certainly has studied varnish making more than I, and has made more experiments too. Some would say that his varnishes are expensive, but I use just 15 grams of it to varnish an instrument at the cost of 15 bucks, a pittance compared with the rest of the materials used to make a good instrument.
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actonern · Super Member Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 444

Manfio:

I know from other posts that you use the Marciano recipe for your ground varnish... just wondering... are there qualities about the varnish that you think make it unsuitable for subsequent coats?

MANFIO · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:32 am Post subject:

Hi! Good question!

Basically lack of experience... I should have to make lots of experiments and I have many instruments to make... And I like so much my current system that I really do not want to risk. But the Marciana varnish works better in the ground than the Magister varnish, I think.

A good feature about Magister varnish is that it has self levelling property (even when diluted with kerosene) that makes it quite easy to apply. And it dries well and quickly in an UV box.

So, basically, I haven't experimented to varnish entirely with the Marciana varnish because I'm happy with my current system, but I know makers that are using only the Marciana varnish.
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actonern · Super Member Joined: 15 Aug 2007 Posts: 444

Thanks, Manfio:

By the way, when you cook your Marciano recipe, do you leave it on the heat until it reaches the "string" test... where a spot of varnish between the thumb and forefinger can be drawn apart in a string?

If so, how long does that typically take, and at what temperature, if you don't mind my endless questions!

MANFIO · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 1:12 pm Post subject:

No, I don't do that... I cook the oil first for about 20 minutes, than add the first resin, cook a bit more, then add the second resin and cook more. All cooking may take one hour or a bit more.
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JWH · Member Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 72

Manfio:

Even though I am now partial toward the Magister varnishes and used wisely at a cost of about $10/violin, I've thought about using only the Marciana recipe on an instrument, but wouldn't you be inclined to alter the formula for succeeding coats? What I mean to say is, making a couple batches that have successively more mastic to simulate a lean to fat principle, or working with the oil in combination with the mastic?
John

MANFIO · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 5:11 pm Post subject:

Hi! As a matter of fact I've made just two batches of the Marciana varnish.... in the second batch I used an old, oxidized oil that was thick, and varnish came out sticky to the touch, I'm afraid of using it...

I've never changed the recipe. Neil Ertz, that is an active member in the MAESTRONET Pegbox forum uses this varnish for the colour coatings too, it seems he uses 45 resins 55 oil, if I'm not wrong. You can use the search engine on MAESTRONET to find Neil's posts about this varnish. Neil's instruments are quite beautifull.
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JWH · Member Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 72

That's interesting to hear. Thanks, Manfio.

MANFIO · Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 6:29 pm Post subject:

Try giving a look here:

http://www.maestronet.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=4&threadid=272136&messageid=272165
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mapleleaf_gal · Member Joined: 24 Mar 2007 Posts: 73 Location: tucson, az

i own two jars of his varnish. but do not know the recipe. sorry. i can say that it is very nice varnish to work with and i will last me the rest of my lifetime, probably. ha! (at the rate i make instruments these days)

one is a sandarac walnut oil and the other a pine resin walnut oil. the pine is very dark and thinner. the walnut lighter and thicker. i mix the two to get what i want.
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JWH · Member Joined: 26 Mar 2007 Posts: 72

The Ertz photos won't come up, Manfio. After so long, the hosts delete the pictures I think.
Jacob's picture on that page, of course, is embedded and comes up.

Funny Ertz mentioned the price of the Baese book as you did. This is one where price drove me to use our university ILL service. Our national university Inter-Library Loan service is an absolutely great resource. It's worth the price of patronage.