Violin Forum/Message Board

[Barry Dudley]

I received a phone call from one of my 5 string customers telling me he had tuned the violin down 1/2 step for a recording session and it sent the violin into tubo drive. He said it was like a completely different instrument.
He was very happy with the violin to start with and discovered this by accident.
Does anybody know why the violin came to life so much more when tuned down?
He said it was not just a note or two but everything he played. The recording engineer even ask what he did to the violin.
Does it have something to do with string pressure? It seems if it were just a resonance coupling type thing it would just happen with certain notes? I have seen something like this in other instruments but not nearly so pronounced.
At first I thought it might be some sort of Helmholtz coupling thing but if that were the case it would only happen on the notes that fit the resonance freq. right???
Someone else suggested that I had made the violin too light and if I put light gage strings on it that might help.
The violin is a very good violin. It has great volume, projection and is very balanced when tuned to standard pitch. It is built basically the same as all the others.
Any brilliant ideas? Michael I was hoping you might have some thoughts on this.

[jethro]

Can you give us more details on how the sound changed?

I just finnished adjusting the bridge on my 2-nd. I had a bridge on it that had a relatively thin and sharp top section. I just didn't play easily or sound good. I tried tuneing it down a fifth and it sounded more viola like
and MUCH warmer and the feel of the strings was much closer to normal.
(could I just claim it was a viola???? :-} )

I discovered it liked a thicker bridge and a blunter top edge- which straightened out all the
problems at the violin tuneing.
It all most seems like there is some
kind of connection between string tension and bridge thickness.
Not sure quite what it is yet ......

Could it be that by changing the string tuneing you are moving into or
out of a bridge cut off frequency or a pass frequency ??????????
If that is the case it might suggest a slight bridge adjustment might
do the same thing at the normal tuneing. Also my 2-nd violin seemed
to like it's bridge ankles relatively thin. It kind of loosened up and
"came alive" as I thinned the ankles. The note attacks became more
immediate and instant and feel more effortless and can now happen at
very small bow pressures. Playing and jumping strings is now allmost
like autopilot or power steering !
Keep in mink I am just beginning to make instruments so take my
opinions with a couple of pounds of salt !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Tim

[jessupe goldastini]

mr. anger, i belive likes to play "octave strings" on many of his sessions, so i feel this gives the violin a more liquid "action" in the setup, de-tuning probaly offers such playability...

also...detuning will change the actual frequencys that are being distributed through the plates...

motorcycles,cars and trucks are a good way to describe this...

there you are driving down the road with your smooth running engine, as you approach a truck in front of you, the rumble frequncys of his engine mix with your fequncys, suddenly your smooth running motor "feels/sounds" like its running rough,like theres a "cycle" or pulse to it, as you pass the smooth sound returns,........or....there you are driving down the road in your ss chevelle with a 454 rat motor, as you idle low a motorcycle comes by and mixes with your frequencys, suddenly your car smooths out and sounds like a 4 cylinder car, as he goes the rumble comes back....

the string tension effects the plate tune via what freqencys are being excited,

i think of each plate as two separate motors passing each other on the road, and then staying side by side as they drive along, a good violin will vibrate them in a pleasant harmonic way as they travel down the road of a song, the detuning aquired a more pleasant harmonic sequence that is distributed through the entire violin


in my opinion

[Barry Dudley]

This is not the fiddle for Darol Anger...I am still varnishing his violin.
Several have suggested that the string tension is to high and I should just try lighter gauge strings.

[chrisandcello]

My opinion for what its worth.......maybe related to break angle.....(hence 'string downforce')....lowering the pitch a little would be like having a lower break angle over the bridge........lower action, slightly tighter neck angle or a higher saddle would have the same effect...as well as lower tension strings.......you could mimick a higher saddle by padding it a little to see maybe.....soundpost tension is another thought......but a string switch would be simple enough.....5 string is a different beast to tame maybe............just thoughts.........

[chrisandcello]

Barry....when you get to the bottom of the 1/2 step thing... I'd be interested to read what changes you made.........

[Gizmo]

I have often wondered if, indeed, any typical violin (body) is really tweeked for GDAE tuning. Is that somehow "automatic" in the design/construction of the instrument ?
_________________
I NEVER PRACTICE. I'M NOT FAMOUS YET.

[Jack H.]

[Gizmo]

One more question ......

Is a 15" viola a simple extrapolation of (14") violin dimensions by some fixed ratio ? ( 15/14 ?? ). I'm referring of course to the main body features of the instrument.
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I NEVER PRACTICE. I'M NOT FAMOUS YET.